Forum Topics WBC WBC 14% return from zero growth?

Pinned straw:

Added 12 months ago

Not possible you might say…and don’t go near the banks says @Strawmanand most other Strawpeople!

How could a business with zero growth that just scrapes in on double digit ROE (10%) return it’s investors 14% in just 13 months? A few things need to go right to achieve this return. Tomorrow Westpac will go ex-dividend (72 cps fully franked, or $1.02 including the credits). Over the next 13 months Westpac will likely pay out 3 similar dividends totalling $3.06. That’s a 14% return if you include the franking credits.

Is this a dividend trap? Yes, most likely if you are thinking long-term. Why would you buy a business with zero growth?

In my view Westpac is not a keeper! However if you managed to sell the stock after the next 3 dividends (includes the upcoming dividend) at the current price, then your return would be 14%. The consensus target price from 15 analysts on Simply Wall Street is $21.80. So capital growth is unlikely, and you need the current value to be maintained to achieve a 14% return.

This strategy is not without its risks though. With the recent 0.25% interest rate hike (and the possibly of more to come), there will be more distressed clients and more defaults on home loan repayments. Not to mention, the RBA might overshoot the mark sending the economy into a recession. The big four won’t fair too well under these circumstances. They won’t go broke, but you might be waiting a long while to recover your investment capital!

This strategy is not for everyone, and not my preferred style of investment either. However, given the banks are so unloved at the moment and Westpac lost over 2.5% yesterday in anticipation of the RBA interest rate announcement, particularly following a good result the day before, I couldn’t resist IRL! The on-market share buy back should help maintain the share price also. I guess time will tell!

Disc: “Just think what else you could be doing with your money” and “There’s a good chance you’re about to lose” - borrowed from Sports Bet! :)

Solvetheriddle
Added 12 months ago

@Rick i don't know hopw ma y times i have heard this one over the years, roll the dice, see how you go, the downside is probably not that great

always seems to work the time that you dont do it!

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thunderhead
Added 12 months ago

Yeah, it is a bit of a gamble because there is no guarantee your capital will be preserved while you are collecting the divvies. Also, the divvies can be cut abruptly.

Westpac is also driving returns with massive cost cuts - as the man of Straw has been heard opining, you can't cut your way to greatness!

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edgescape
Added 12 months ago

@Rick

Also why sometimes you can't use ROE as a metric. I can think of lots of ways in "skinning the cat" in order to boost ROE. And Westpac is doing it quite well.

ROE can only apply in certain situations.

Anyway why am I wasting time discussing a bank? Service has been so poor now and my list of negatives towards the big 4 grows. Torching capital if you bought at $40.

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Rick
Added 12 months ago

@edgescape thanks for your reply. I promise I’m not going to ask you to talk any more about banks! :) However I am keen to hear more about your thoughts on the traps in using ROE as a metric and when you shouldn’t use it.

Leverage is a big one to watch. I prefer debt free, however there is a case to leverage for growth when ROE is high eg. LOV and NCK. Telstra propped its ROE up for years using high debt, and it still does even though ROE has halved.

NPAT can also be tricky when it comes to underlying and reported figures. Shareholder equity value can also be manipulated, however this needs to be lowered to I improve ROE. I’d love to hear your thoughts on this.

Cheers,

Rick

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edgescape
Added 12 months ago

I think you mentioned most of the ones I had in mind

Thinking quickly off the top of my head:

  1. Cost cutting and removal of services to improve profit and return. Westpac/St George doing that brilliantly right now by closing branches and closing foreign exchange services. Reducing system maintenance (the logins haven't really changed) I guess that would reduce depreciation/amorisation expense?
  2. Share buybacks. That would reduce shareholder equity and increase EPS.


So I guess all has to be taken in context.

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