Forum Topics Investing the last liberal art (Hagstrom)--worth a read, imo
neke86_
Added 2 years ago

I haven't, and won't, read Hagstrom due to time constraints. However, as a formally trained intelligence analyst I've always found it mildly amusing that the investing community so often hold themselves in such high regard as bastions of intellect. Basic principles and techniques of analysis would serve any investor well, and these concepts have been around for decades (or centuries). I don't understand the allure of Buffett and Munger, I understand that they are/were fabulously wealthy, but their advice is utterly generic and I don't really see anybody turning it into an edge for themselves.

Look outside the the usual places: teach yourself to do a study of competing hypotheses, learn how to assess the validity of a source of information, understand how, when, and why people are lying to you, learn good investigative practices. Some reading available on Amazon, it isn't cheap but good learning isn't free :)

  1. https://amzn.asia/d/0cn43aOw
  2. https://amzn.asia/d/0bIhuwBu


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Strawman
Added 2 years ago

There's definitely a very "duh, that's obvious" vibe with Buffett/Munger stuff @neke86_

(Although a lot of that common sense stuff is not that common! Especially from an investing class that loves complexity for the sake of it)

Thanks for the reading tips. And love that they're not investing focused (but highly relevant).

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UlladullaDave
Added 2 years ago

There's nothing wrong with reinforcing basic principles, which I assume is most of the attraction of Buffett and Munger. The early letters are a great primer on investing, but they have pretty low utility at this point as far as a market beating edge – on the other hand, perhaps the intended audience isn't trying to be world beating they just want a basic framework for not losing money that is reasonably accessible.

I have to be honest, I kind of switch off when I hear someone start talking about Buffett, usually they are trying to sell me something or just repeating a very basic observation that long ago was accepted as conventional wisdom.

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Solvetheriddle
Added 2 years ago


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Have you ever wondered what Munger referred to when kept mentioning using “Mental Models”? This book has a go at explaining many of these. Given the difficulty of this task, it’s a reasonable effort and worth the read.

As an aside, there is an SM-related story that I found interesting. The book covers why the group view is superior to the individual view, regardless of the underlying ability of the group. Many would say that SM should deliver better returns as a group compared to the vast bulk of individuals. I recall some stating that belief on the site in the past. The book mentions that this rule holds as long as the group is diverse and independent. SM is certainly diverse from what I can tell, it’s not full of, for example, finance boffins. Is it independent? In other words, is the group overly influenced by the stock selection of gurus, such as SM or Wini? The theory states if the group is so influenced it would be detrimental to portfolio performance. Interesting, I'll leave that assessment to others.

A reason I am interested and refer to the impact of biases on investment returns, and the importance of having a strong philosophy and process, is that I can see clear issues in my decision-making process that have room for improvement. As the book says markets evolve, what worked for you in the 1990’s for example, will likely work much less well now. The best investors evolve.

An investing approach, among some, relies on turning over as many new stock ideas as possible with the hope that you will find a huge winner. This assumes that you will recognise the stock and importantly, hold it to fruition. The errors I am looking to fix are a bit different to that approach. I have closely researched and even held stocks that went on to be very successful, but I have either passed over these great ideas or given up, I believe, because of biases. The ideas have been there in plain sight. It has not been a discovery process but a lack of recognition ability in my existing universe. (quality growth)

A possible way to fix this error is to have a flexible thought process to properly integrate new information and not be stuck in the original scenario to the detriment of other possibilities as they evolve. Laziness is much of the root cause as this approach uses intense thought and effort.

The book is not an easy read, and Hagstrom says as much, it was hard to write. The ideas here are complex and application takes much effort and discipline. There are many useful tools here. I will attempt to write up the book in detail, before results season and put it in my journal.


as an afterthought, the guys on TIP "we study billionaires" did a couple of hours on the book, if reading isn't your thing

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Strawman
Added 2 years ago

I've had this on my reading list forever @Solvetheriddle, so this is a good prompt to finally do it.

I have read "the Warren Buffett way" from the same author, and thought he did a great job of synthesising all of Buffett's ideas.

Also, I agree that group think is our biggest risk factor. I take some solace in the fact that the portfolios of the top members tend to have only minimal overlap. And I hope no one feels restrained in pushing back against anything I or others say.

Lord knows I've had some terrible takes over the years :)

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Solvetheriddle
Added 2 years ago

@Strawman as you say you can take someone's idea but can't take on their conviction. no use blaming them either. Im finding that the transition from professional investor to private investor has some interesting unexpected nuances. always room for improvement. :)

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