Forum Topics Life After Lithium
Timocracy
2 years ago

I've had an opinion of lithium-ion batteries, that they aren't the be-all and end-all of portable electricity and power storage. This opinion is more of logic than a background in battery science and seeing that we're getting closer and closer to the limitations of Li-ion batteries. Density is one thing, but degradation is an issue that I personally believe will be bigger in the next 5-10 years than we have ever been able to comprehend.

Besides recycling etc. I'd like to know if anybody had further insights into research or companies worth taking a look at that have opportunistic potential over the next decade.


NDB's (Nuclear/Nano Diamond Batteries) are starting to get a bit more talk now, and I've always seen solid state battery technology as a cheaper way of moving forward.


I'm viewing this as an evolution much like cassettes and VHS moving to CD's and DVD's....only to be obliterated by newer tech, compact hard drives, cloud storage and digital streaming that didn't seem possible on a consumer level a decade prior.



Food for thought: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeVOFydscAo

12
CanadianAussie
2 years ago

Hi @tbra97


You raise some interesting points. Solid state batteries have been a threat to Li ion for some time. However, my understanding is that solid state batteries are expensive and with batteries already making up ~30% of the cost of an EV, even if or when a solid state battery is developed cost has to be considered vs benefit. This threat to Li ion has also been around for ages with nothing to show for it.


NVX has some interesting IP I'd recommend having a look at. They currently have the best anode on the market that's been qualified by a tier 1 global battery manufacturer. Their testing results should ease any concerns around degradation or travel distance on a single charge as they've shown strong results.


I'm not a big fan of battery recycling plays from an investing standpoint purely because it seems way too early. I think it will be a much bigger industry x years after a more significant % of cars sold are EVs. X being the average battery life until needing to be replaced - 5 - 10yrs maybe?


While it may not answer your questions above, I found the following podcast on EVs very interesting.

https://castbox.fm/vb/477515232

If the link doesn't work it's

Darren Palmer on the EV Revolution - Masters in Business


20
Timocracy
2 years ago

@CanadianAussie I'll take a dive into the podcasts! Thanks!

You've done a better job of clarifying my own perspective on the recycling theme, especially considering timelines and what the benefit ends up being. (That includes the other hypothetical playing out where there is a better alternative thus little need to waste time and money on recycling lithium batteries)


I've watched some of the back and forth with NVX but never taking a proper look at what they do and why so there's a start for me regardless.


I suppose with the solid-state issue it might only take a couple of years of China building some 'gigafactories' and a few billion dollars of freshly printed currency to get the ball rolling if it was worth pursuing. Even still, that takes away from the idea of investing in it.

Personally I'm looking forward to the day where society is able to put aside some misconceptions about the words "nuclear" and "radiation". Then humanity might be able to make some real progress.

14
Timocracy
2 years ago

@slymeat awesome contribution to the post.


With regards to the recycling, I also share investments in NMT and MNS. I believe there will be a significant ramp up in the need to recycle the battery minerals however I do take a bit of a reflective view when looking at how the world has managed resources in the past. If it's quicker and cheaper to dig a hole and fill it with waste, I reckon that'll be where a lot of it heads without laws coming in and people protesting. Though clearly society is behaving in favour of climate and renewable action.

I also hold a 1% position in HZR to keep an eye on it.

PS how was that ride up on PPK? I was confident around the $6-$12 mark but eventually sold my entire position over $20. Bought back in around $5 and obviously looking at it now, I'm a bit behind. Looking forward to some better news and might do some more research to determine whether it's worth rebuilding a significant investment. Hope you fared well on that rollercoaster.

No matter what, I'm excited to see what the next decade brings. Definitely a 'generally assumed' future but I'm most looking forward to the technologies that we wouldn't even be able to comprehend at this point in time.


Appreciate your comments

15