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Added 4 months ago

Firstlinks: Looking beyond banks for dividend income

James Gruber, 20 November 2024

The Big Four banks have had a stellar run over the past 12 months. For instance, Commonwealth Bank (ASX: CBA) is up 56% during the period, and 43% year-to-date. It’s a head spinning move for the ASX’s largest stock with a market capitalization of $260 billion.

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Source: Morningstar

Is CBA a $115 billion better business (the equivalent of Westpac's current market capitalisation) than a year ago? Not if you go by earnings, which were down 2% in the last financial year. The prospects for future earnings aren’t impressive either, with most analysts looking for mid-single digit growth over the next three years. And these analysts assume provisions for bad debts remain near all-time lows – a big assumption.

What explains the rampant run-up in bank share prices? ‘Fundamentals’ as we like to call them in the finance industry don’t explain the moves. More likely, it’s liquidity. Mining stocks have been in the doldrums and large fund managers and super funds have essentially been forced to buy the banks to get returns. Passive ETFs have amplified the price rises.

Gone are the good old days

Once upon a time, the banks offered high starting yields (due to lower prices), with steady, growing dividend streams, but that’s now a distant memory. For instance, CBA grew dividends by a compound annual growth rate (CAGR) of 9.2% in the decade to 2003, by 8.9% in the decade to 2013, but by just 1.74% in the decade to 2023. Similarly, Westpac increased dividends by 9% CAGR in the ten years to 2003, by 9.5% in the following ten years, yet dividends declined by 3.1% per annum in the decade to 2023.

The slowing dividend growth is the result of slowing earnings growth, due to a host of reasons. Increased competition for deposits and loans, greater capital requirements, slowing credit and economic growth, and other factors have played a part.

Future earnings growth also looks tepid at best, and consequently so does dividend growth. Even with franking credits, the picture doesn’t appear anywhere near as positive as it did over much of the past 40 years.

Yet, the current share prices don’t reflect this. CBA is sporting a price-to-earnings ratio (PER) of 27.7x, making it the most expensive bank in the developed world, and by a distance. The PERs of the other banks are cheaper, though far from cheap: Westpac (ASX: WBC) at 17.4x, NAB (ASX: NAB) at 17.5x, and ANZ (ASX: ANZ) at 15x.

These high prices have left dividend yields at the lower end of history, with CBA’s yield at 3%, Westpac’s 4.5% NAB’s 4.3%, and ANZ’s at 5.1%.

Looking beyond banks

Banks have been the go-to source of dividend income for investors for years, yet they don’t offer the same prospects for high, growing income that they once did. What should investors do?

The yields on banks aren’t disastrous, so I’m not suggesting that it’s time to cut and run from them. However, it does seem an opportune time to look beyond the banks for better dividend prospects.

Here are some ideas:

Steady compounders. These are potential bank alternatives, offering steady, growing income. I like medical insurers such as Medibank Private (ASX: MPL) and NIB (ASX: NHF), with dividend yields of 4.4% and 5% respectively. Yes, there are risks around hospital cost negotiations, yet these seem to be at least partially priced in. While pricing is set by government, growing demand for private healthcare should ensure increasing earnings and dividends for many years.

Origin Energy (ASX: ORG) is another one in this category. It’s the country’s electricity and gas supplier and its attractive prospects have made it the subject of takeover bids. With a 5.1% yield and reasonable valuations, it deserves a place in income portfolios.

Dividend growers. This group of companies comprises great businesses with relatively low dividend yields but with opportunities to grow those dividends at a brisk clip. Brambles (ASX: BXB) is one, offering a yield of 2.6%, albeit only partly franked. Resmed (ASX: RMD) is another, with a paltry yield of 0.8%, but with a great track record of increasing dividends (more than 7% CAGR over the past ten years). And a personal favourite is Washington H. Soul Pattison (ASX: SOL). It has raised dividends in each of the past 24 years, by 10% per annum. It’s a phenomenal track record that’s unlikely to be repeated. However, the future still appears bright for the conglomerate. Soul Patts offers a 2.7% current dividend yield.

Comeback stories, returning cash. Here are stocks where there is real value and the potential for business turnarounds and for cash to be returned to shareholders. Ramsay Health Care (ASX: RHC) offers a possible opportunity. Better returns should come from an increased focus on its Australian assets. Also, negotiations with insurance funds over costs could prove a catalyst for the stock.

Perpetual (ASX: PPT) is another one. Everyone hates the company given its history. Yet, it’s inexpensive and if a proposed demerger goes ahead, that should result in about a billion dollars finding its way back to shareholders.

What didn’t make the list

There are notable absentees from the stock ideas above. First, there are no miners. I just don’t think miners deserve a large spot in portfolio given their volatile earnings and dividends. Second, the supermarkets are excluded too. Despite recent issues, the shares still seem on the expensive side and dividends aren’t compelling. Government pressure is effectively capping pricing, and they’re still dealing with cost issues.

What about dividend ETFs?

Given ETFs are all the rage, the inevitable question is whether there are ETFs that can provide investors with decent dividend income. My issue with a lot of the dividend ETFs is that they’re loaded with banks and materials companies. For example, the largest dividend ETF, Vanguard’s Australian Shares High Yield ETF (ASX: VHY) has 66% exposure to financials and materials, in line with its benchmark. It’s fine if that’s what you’re looking for. However, if you want to diversify away from banks and miners for yield, then please carefully read the fine print of dividend ETFs.

Are international shares an option?

International shares are an option for those seeking income. However, these shares don’t have the franking credits that are on offer in Australia. For this reason, I’ve always looking for yield in Australia and growth outside of it. It’s a strategy that may not suit everyone and depends on your circumstances.

 

James Gruber is editor of Firstlinks and Morningstar.


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Source: https://www.firstlinks.com.au/looking-beyond-banks-dividend-income


Disclosure: I do not hold CBA or any bank.

According to Commsec CBA is currently very expensive at 3.58 x book value - possibly the most expensive bank of scale in the world.

The decision to sell if you've held CBA for years is more complex because of things like CGT considerations, and the dividend yield based on your buy price being OK, rather than the current dividend yield now based on where they are trading today - which is low. However, in terms of CBA being a "Buy" up here... Yeah, Nah! Not even close.

When overseas money and then passive funds flow back out of our large banks, there will be significant downside - because there's so far to fall back to book value and also down to an above-market dividend yield.

And with the likely market volatility alongside possible economic risks we're likely to experience in 2025 - including the risk of the A$ falling further against the US$ - our big banks are not going to be as "safe as houses" in my opinion.

Clio
Added 4 months ago

Further to what is making CBA (and the other big three to a lesser extent) run so hard: I watched an interview by Rask with Nathan Bell (of Intelligent Investor, manages the IIFs) and Nathan was bemoaning how he couldn't bring himself (via his income fund) to hold the banks earlier in the year and so has underperformed significantly, purely because of that.

Because of that, he went looking for data on who was buying our Big 4 Bank shares (Cumulative Net Purchases). His data (below) came either from Shaw and Partners or Macquarie (I can't remember but it was one or the other) and it tracks three groups - Australian retail investors, Australian institutions and International institutions - buying the banks back to 2001.

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Nathan's explanation for the increased buying from Australian institutions was that they're being drawn into it because of fund managers having to cover their returns against benchmark and also ETF managers having to continually buy.

His explanation for the increased buying from International Institutions was that a lot of money has been and still is fleeing China, and needs somewhere "safe" to go, and at least for the short term, the international fund managers involved are not so much concerned with returns as with financial stability = safety and capital preservation.

For that, CBA and our big banks are viewed (rightly or wrongly) as the perfect place to park the funds while they find some better-returning but safe place to put them or wait out the current global issues.

I found the explanation interesting and have to wonder what it means for this crazy bank rally when those international fund managers do find viable investments with better returns and reallocate their funds.

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Clio
Added 4 months ago

I do think the limited supply is one significant driver. I've held CBA in my SMSF for yonks, and now the SMSF is in pension mode and 0% tax, I've been selling off in tranches. First tranche went at $140 - actually sold at $143 once the order went through! Second tranche I had planned to execute at $144 - by the time I returned from OS (only away for 2 weeks), it went for $158! Waiting to see where it goes before I pull the lever for the third and last tranche. Doing much the same for the other three big banks as well. BUT according to my financial advisor, I'm in the minority. He had two separate clients in the last week who, when he gently suggested selling CBA would be a good idea because they needed the cash and are also in the 0% tax situation, both swore they were dying with those shares. Why??? But there you are. Boomers who bought at the float seem determined to cling to those shares forever. Well...I have to admit I'll still be holding some, but a much much smaller number.

Discl: All 4 big banks still held IRL - but only in SMSF for for the dividend

15

lowway
Added 4 months ago

Sounds like you've ridden the bank wave nicely @Clio. Whilst fully franked dividends in a zero tax environment are superb, the price of banks now would indicate that the fully franked yield, that has been so good for so long, is waning somewhat.

The hard part for me has always been to find that goldilocks balance between a raasonable fully franked dividend stock that also had reasonable potential for capital growth. The fact there is also no CGT complications in the zero tax environment makes this my most desired outcome. I didn't get this with the 4 big banks, so instead did a bit of dividend stripping over the last few years, but now find them far too expensive for that somewhat fraught strategy.

My go to stocks are still usually associated with finance/investment, (large holder of $MQG even though it's not fully franked) or smaller banks such as $BEN.

Additionally I like the return currently from $WLE.

Tend to align with @Bear77 post on the four big banks but then again, I haven't been a holder during the latest bull run, so missed out on that unlike your good self!!


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Solvetheriddle
Added 4 months ago

One theory I have a bit of trouble getting on board with is that passive money alone is driving the CBA share price to ATHs. If that were the case, why isn't CSL, BHP, etc., in fact, all of the ASX200, which all get passive flows at ATH? IMO, the issue is with the supply side, not the demand side. Im a holder of CBA, have been for decades, which means a big CGT liability on sale. CBA has a high retail skew, as opposed to other large-cap stocks, in this case, it restricts supply. to be clear, i would sell the lot if the tax bill was lower, so now i dribble them out. i suspect many are in the same place, or the usual retail strategy, its going up hold on. those of us who believe valuations win in the end (although that may be a long road in some cases), wouldn't go near it. there are a few others for different reasons as well. perversely bad news could have a bigger counter impact.

held --maybe i can do a synthetic that locks in today's price and sells some every year so it spreads the tax over many years.

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Mujo
Added 4 months ago

It is included in the global financials index with a large weight which has seen a lot of passive buying with US small regional banks supposedly all good again - benefited from Trump etc.

Assume also many bailing from resources due to China and looking for an alternative.

Then momentum.

All my speculation.



12

Solvetheriddle
Added 4 months ago

@Mujo i think you are probably correct, all low-conviction buying IMO. i would add that a lot of long-onlys have looked at their attribution and seen the damage CBA has done and reacted the way they always do, covering the short (against the b/m, not an actual short). again low conviction buying. i feel there is some arse covering in PME and WTC occurring as well.

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Bear77
Added 4 months ago

Yes @Mujo & @Solvetheriddle there are some indices that are not broad-based - so do not include companies like BHP along with CBA - and Global Financials is one example as you say @Mujo - also some global ESG-filtered so-called "smart ETFs" probably also include many financial companies such as banks but not miners, however my thoughts are that overseas investors have been diversifying away from ONLY holding US stocks - so I'm talking about ACTIVE here not passive money, and they are wary of resources but a large bank like CBA, the leading Australian bank and a large bank by global standards as well, looks good and they have been buying it. That drives up the price, which is turbocharged by the limited supply that @Solvetheriddle mentions, and the result of that is that CBA becomes an even LARGER constituent of whatever global indices they are in, and then passive money inflows magnifies this further.

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Rick
Added 4 months ago

Sold another small parcel today at $160. The tax man is going to love me this year!

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Strawman
Added 4 months ago

Well said @Bear77

Who knows how or when, but things like P/B and P/E will most surely mean-revert for CBA at some stage. Either that, or we are at a permanently new normal (which I very much doubt).

18

Tom73
Added 4 months ago

It seems the SM community is at the SELL or at best HOLD for tax reasons on CBA and I agree.

So much so that I have chosen to sell, but my problem was the only CBA I held was in my super which are index funds and that I hold as part of the VAS which, due to circumstances I have a position in for the next 2-3 months.

Hence, I tried to short CBA via my Interactive Brokers account, but they seemed to not be able to find a supply to short (or are not letting me...). This was at $145 and the delay has been of obvious benefit but I still would have been happy shorting at $145 which is ridiculously overvalued.

In terms of risk, it is mostly hedged via by superannuation holding and VAS holding, so it was as much a hedge against those being impacted via a drop in CBA's price. I also don't see much risk of the "unlimited losses" that are technically on the table. If CBA doubles and everything else stands still - someone broke reality! If everything else also went up then gains on the rest of my portfolio would dwarf any loss on a CBA short.

Faced with the "can't short" I did what is considered an equally risky and in my case an equally new investment type. The selling of a naked call option!

Likewise, the downside risk is mostly hedged and very small in terms of portfolio size. The quantity is the same as those I intended to short but due to price moves the strike is $156 and a December expiry. Potential gain and loss is more limited due to the premium reducing the potential loss and the gain limited to the premium, but it does the job of making me feel less pained that I am holding CBA indirectly and aggrieved by the ridiculous price it's at.

I have traded a lot of options over a long time but never gone naked (mostly long but some covered calls) and I have only shorted a stock once as part of an experiment to hedge a buyout for script so it was effectively covered on transaction completion.

I don't wish a lower price on CBA holders, but the value isn't at the current price and the weight of money behind it is for all the wrong reasons when it comes to value so I maintain the price must fall but no clear idea when as usual.

We will see how it goes from here...


10

Parko5
Added 4 months ago

I think I posted here a couple of months ago...I sold all the family bank stocks in the SMSF and have put into a term deposit. I had lots of reasons.....but I have just seen all the STRONG SELL recommendations, lots of hedge funds starting to short the banks etc etc.

It really feels like the momentum/sentiment has changed....and people are now starting to consider selling. Apart from the overseas cash inflows...and then the magnifer effect of the ETF.....what have the banks done to deserve these current SPs?

Also I see the cost of banking going up. My mate's who work in Bank IT systems....told me that these banks are having to spend massive amounts of money to stop all these frauds.....and to really get on top of it....need to spend x10 more (that was really a guess)......So i think the realisation of this type of spend will only happen in a few years time.

To see the scale of the problem...check this out:

https://www.voanews.com/a/report-southeast-asia-scam-centers-swindle-billions/7655765.html

There are whole towns run by Govt militry/underworld....dedicated to scams. Effectively State sponsored crime...and Aust is a massive target. Banks and Superfunds.....they all need to invest in latest tech...which is hard on their old systems. Also note how many times in the last few years we have heard about bank's systems going down. Massive legacy issues.....and they are not spending enough to sort these out.




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SudMav
Added 4 months ago

Just wanted to add a perspective from someone who just sold their house. We just had our place sell in Adelaide and ira quite clear right now that the delay in interest rate cuts is having a significant impact on the number of interested buyers out there in the market. Our agent has been around for a while and was genuinely concerned about the outlook for next year.

We are starting to see a lot more listings here continually reduce their prices and increased instances of purchasers trying to get out of their auction contracts. Lots of inspections have 0-1 interested buyers.

in summary the re market here is starting to show some signs of a wobble or a bit of a correction, but this could just be a temporary thing that corrects after the new year. If it’s something that persists however it could be a sign of weakening demand and/or the cost of living pressures impacting house prices and willingness to take out new loans.

totally different consideration to the other CBA discussion above but thought it may be of interest to you all

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Strawman
Added 4 months ago

Interesting @SudMav

Sounds similar to what the AFR was reporting on the Sydney market today

https://www.afr.com//property/residential/sydney-home-prices-sink-again-as-vendors-rush-to-sell-before-auction-20241124-p5kt20?btis

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