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#FY20 results - Thoughts
Added 2 days ago

Appen has grown into a fairly complex company over the last few years and the results take a bit of time to wade through, digest and contextualise. This is exacerbated by the extremities presented in 2020 making extrapolation of results in that year nigh impossible.


Some points are raised that are worth considering…


Appen have said that online advertising spend softened in 2020. Are we supposed to believe this given the record shift to online and a US election thrown in? While some are rightfully sceptical I think that it is possible as uncertainty leads companies to preserve cash and even if customers were spending more on advertising online APX is several steps removed from this direct spend and it is entirely possible that their customers delayed or reduced R&D and non-essential spending in their AI projects that require these data sets.


Currency had a wild year with the AUD swinging between mid 50 cents to mid 70 cents USD. Appen have given projections with the rough average of the exchange rate last year to allow them to “contextualise” the numbers. While that sounds reasonable unfortunately the AUD has rocketed up to almost 80 cents now so is going to be a significant headwind unless there is a reversal back down. Of course it could even move higher. That said the important thing is being aware of this. I try to construct my portfolio in a way to diversify across large currency movements. If you are like me and earn AUD it can also be worth remembering that although this hurts Appen your global buying power is rising so I don’t hate this kind of exposure. I certainly wasn’t complaining when the FX provided a free kick in the other direction.


When you look at the revenue by customer of the five largest 1 had good growth two reduced spending and two stayed roughly the same. Something to watch.


China growth is currently +60% quarter on quarter from a low base while it won’t continue at this rate it implies it could have revenue from $15 – 90million in just two years time (probably lower end). While speculative and currently immaterial if this was a separate listed entity on the ASX it would probably trade for $200+ mil valuation.


New customer acquisition is accelerating as they learn how to sell to smaller entities. This will help to mitigate the significant customer concentration risk.


Competition still not a major issue with essentially a competitive duopoly in place between Appen and Lionbridge.


No concerns raised invalidate my thesis for Appen and my expectation is medium to strong sustainable growth for at least the next five years. No view on the AUD.


I would recommend listening to the call to get some extra explanation of the presented numbers from the company that can be found here.

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#ASX Announcements
Last edited 2 days ago

24 February 2021

Appen Maintains Solid Growth

Appen Limited (Appen) (ASX:APX) a global leader in the development of high-quality, human annotated datasets for machine learning and artificial intelligence(AI), has today announced its results for the full year ended 31 December 2020

  • Revenue up 12% to $599.9M
  • Underlying EBITDA of $108.6M up 8%, statutory EBITDA up 23%
  • Growing customer base including 136 new customer wins in 2020
  • 34% increase in the number of projects with top five customers
  • Committed revenue increased to 31% of 2H20 total revenue, up from 12% in 1H20
  • China revenue growing at 60% quarter on quarter
  • $78M in cash at 31 December 2020
  • Final dividend of 5.5 cps, 50% franked, up 10% on 2019 final dividend
  • Full year underlying EBITDA for the year ending 31 December 2021 is expected to be in the range of A$120M - A$130M, representing growth of 18% - 28% on FY20 underlying EBITDA (ex. FX gain) of $101.8M
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#AI and Data Collection
Added 3 days ago

Jan 15 By Tyler Galagher

Wisdom From The Women Leading The AI Industry, With Dr. Judith Bishop of Appen


Can you tell our readers about the most interesting projects you are working on now?

There are no uninteresting projects in AI, and while I can’t give specifics, we’ve started to move into multimodal data creation and product evaluation projects that require a new focus on time and timing — for example, how the visual output of the AI engine, such as an avatar face or face and body, aligns in time with the synthesized speech. Human beings are super keyed into timing. It’s usually at a subliminal level, but as you know from watching poorly dubbed movies, any slight misalignment between channels can really make the experience challenging.

What are the 5 things that most excite you about the AI industry? Why?

What excites me most about AI is that it’s aimed both at mimicking and exceeding human capabilities of reasoning, perception and communication. The knowledge we’ll gain about ourselves through developing AI — how we interact with each other and with the world — will be so deep. Linguists will be critical to this process because we’ll have to unpack how we communicate in order to help machines learn what we do and how we understand the world.

Another exciting area of development is that, with COVID-19, contactless services will continue to be important to all types of service providers. As we look to convert any situation where you currently have to walk into a room and talk with someone into a contactless service, we’ll continue to look at ways that AI can power chatbots, virtual assistants and the like. In healthcare, for example, there’s tremendous interest in developing AI-powered healthcare assistants that can perform triage to provide more options that eliminate the need for patients who are feeling ill to travel to see a doctor. This type of benefit will be replicated across many industries.

What are the 5 things that concern you about the AI industry? Why?

I would bucket my concerns into two main categories. First is the fact that policy and regulation are lagging far behind AI development. There’s a very real possibility that AI will leave people vulnerable in ways they’ve never been before. AI-powered insights into how we communicate and what we’re expressing and the emotions we’re expressing it with — things most people will want to keep hidden — will be stored in systems and devices. This can create opportunities for abuse.

It’s also a possibility that we could fail to ensure that AI technology is fair in terms of diversity and inclusivity. Whether intentionally or unintentionally, if we use biased training data for AI systems, we could end up replicating existing human bias in powerful AI projects that treat people unfairly on a huge scale. Systemic bias in automated systems for mortgage and credit applications, insurance rates, and even hiring come immediately to mind.


Full text can be found here:


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Added a week ago

In a world where data is the new oil Appen is the leading refinery. Raw unannotated data is about as useful as crude in your family car.

- Content relevance currently requires constant human annotated data to stay relevant (repeat business)
- Upside to language services due to big tech selling into a global market
- Computer vision + text and speech recognition requires lots of high quality annotated data as does machine learning 
- 8/10 top global companies using Appen - What other company has this spread of top quality companies on its books? Also use is still increasing rather than decreasing.
- Substantial free cash flow leading to acquisitions and revenue diversification

- High customer concentration (loss of one major would be substantial impairment)
- Big tech automating data collection through machine learning making Appen's services redundant (unlikely to happen quickly)
- Acquisition integration issues
- Competition (Lionsbridge)

- AUD strength

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#AI and Data Collection
Added a week ago

Appen worked closely with Microsoft on the recent addition of Inuktitut text transalation to Microsoft Translator.

"Inuktitut, a dialect of the Inuit language Inuktut, is spoken across Inuit Nunangat, the Inuit homeland in Canada, and is the mother tongue of about forty thousand Inuit in Canada ", Microsoft.

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#Personal Investment Case
Last edited 2 weeks ago

Appen at current prices appears to be a great opportunity with strong tailwinds behind it for at least the next 10 years. AI is one of Ark Invest's 5 innovative disruptive technologies. However, the investment case requires continual growth at 25%+ which will taper down to 20% by 2030. These are large numbers for a company already creating $500+ million in revenue.

Appen has a nice segment of the market. I found a figure that projects AI data will be 10% of all AI spending. Given Appen only has one other major competitor that I can find this gives Appen the opportunity to realise the revenue figures quoted above.

Customer value proposition:

Appen's value proposition to it's customers is the removal of project risks and provides price certainty. AI requires large and accurate datasets to train AI. For the customer to collect, process and use the data this expands the internal scope of the project. Questions customers have to ask themselves is: how many people to hire, who are the experts and how to hire them short time, what to do with them after collecting the data if it is a short project, how many working hours are required, do we have the correct systems to create and store the data, will  we do this right? By purchasing the AI training data from Appen, all of these risks are removed and the cost is known at the start. The time saving alone could be well worth it in the fast moving tech world.  To use the popular jargon I see Appen as an "AI data/training as a service or AI data/training on demand" company.


  • Appen is a growth company that is strong cashflow positive and profitable.
  • Net cash
  • Strong momentum with growing revenues and profitability. 5 year ROE = 21% CAGR
  • "Picks and shovels of AI"
  • Management has significant skin in the game:
    • Chairman (founder) owns 7.61%
    • CEO and Bill Pulver have high 7 figures of wealth in the company (at current prices)
    • All other directors have at least $1m invested
  • MD pay in comparison to other companies:
    • Base salary is 8th percentile
    • STI is 33rd percentile
    • LIT is 80th percentile
    • Show me the incentive I'll show you the outcome... MD is paid lower for short term and higher for long term outcomes when compared to other similar companies.
  • Unless the case was for a strong bear case. I am yet to see a price estimate or valuation under $20. No sell analyst ratings only buy and hold.
  • Strong network effect having built up over 1 million workers to assist in the processing of data. This would take time to reproduce.
  • China expansion with strong protections of Appen IP ensured. This part of the business is only just getting started. China doesn't appear far of the US in terms of AI tech. A potential area for even more growth.
  • Long term chart - bottom left to top right. Any graph of revenue, profits, cash flows is the same. A great indictor of a company that exceeds in my view. Winners keep winning.
  • AI datasets need continued training. Over time the dataset is outdated or degrades.
  • Price appears to have a strong floor at around $20-22 since Feb 19. Dipped well below a long term 3 point trend line (on log scale).
  • Industry growth expected to be around 28% a year.


  • Concentration of customers - Top 5 clients provide 88% of revenues.
  • Increasing AUD/USD will reduce profitability
  • Recent announcements of weak figures. Is this a one off?


  • Big tech giants take AI data work in house due to the amount of data they require it may become more economical or this puts pressure on margins.
  • Growth stops and is not as strong as predicted.
  • I can't find many negative reports on Appen therefore research and thesis could be based on confirmation bias.
  • Current figures are weak. Company says this is COVID related. What if this is not a one off as widely believed.
  • My figures are way to optimisitic.
  • Losses to other competitors.

When to get out:

  • When growth stops or significantly reduced.
  • Share prices in significant gains for a long time and doesn't discount any risk.
  • Margins are reduced causing a substantial change in valuation that no longer justifies the risk. Appen has had margins in a tight range historically.

Expected outcomes:

  • 30% Worst case - growth stops and Appen can only maintain profitability at current levels. No future growth from here. I use this as a base case given the expected growth in field. PE of 15 + cash = $8.6 per share
  • 60% Expectated outcome - 2030 PE of 30, Revenue growth 25% from 2021 to 2025 then taper to 20%. NPAT = 11% and discounted back at 15% = $32.44 per share.
  • 10% Best case: Same as above but 30% p.a revenue growth for every year to 2030. $82 per share.
  • Overall approximately a 60% downside risk for a 10 year return in the order of 20% p.a. compounding. Target price based on probabilities = $30.22

I see Appen as a strong "value" growth buy. I have been sitting on the fence due to the weak EBITDA expectation. Why only release the expected EBITDA figure? Are the revenue and profit figures worse?  I understand the companies explanation. At a granular level my guess is teams are all working from home in the US and its probably getting to the point where teamwork is dropping off and new projects are less important than keeping to your known strengths.

I will be looking to buy in small chucks to build a position given the current outlook but don't won't hold off if others start to realise the value I see here.

I would be very interested in a forum conversation with anyone who would like to point out what I have got wrong with this thesis! As mentioned I couldn't find many negatives...



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Last edited 3 weeks ago

My predictions for the upcoming annual results are as follows:

  • CY2020 EBITDA = $106M AUD
  • CY2021 EBITDA = $131M AUD to $140M AUD
  • CY2022 EBITDA = $162M AUD to $185M AUD

The low end of the range assumes 24% growth in EBITDA YoY. The high end of the range assumes 32% growth in EBITDA YoY. Astute observers will note that this is a +/- 4% range from APX's guidance around growing earnings in line with industry growth (28% p.a.)

Anyone who is expecting more than $140M AUD for CY2021 EBITDA is perhaps a bit too optimistic. Or perhaps I am being conservative by discounting the power of operating leverage and expanding margins. Regardless, in my eyes, anything above $140M EBITDA for CY2021 would be a spectacular performance (that would be up 32%+ YoY).

If the midpoint of the above EBITDA ranges are hit, on current prices, APX would be trading on 19x CY21 EV/EBITDA and 15x CY22 EV/EBITDA (noting $126M in cash as at 30th June 2020 and a market cap as it stands today at $2.8 billion AUD).

Is that too high? Perhaps. Historically, across the markets as a whole, the general rule of thumb is that EV/EBITDA under 10x is attractive and undervalued. However, that is for the market as a whole, not the tech sector, which commands higher multiples due to stronger growth.

Worldwide, the average value of EV/EBITDA in the technology & telecommunications sector as of 2020 was a multiple of approximately 21.1x, an increase from 15.1x in 2019.

  • Afterpay is at 971x EV/EBITDA.
  • Tesla is at 128x EV/EBITDA.
  • Wisetech Global is at 102x EV/EBITDA.
  • Xero is at 95x EV/EBITDA.
  • Altium is at 58x EV/EBITDA.
  • NextDC is at 55x EV/EBITDA
  • SEEK is at 42x EV/EBITDA.
  • is at 32x EV/EBITDA.
  • Appen is currently on 25x EV/EBITDA (assuming $106M AUD in CY20 EBITDA)

Today, there are some examples of eye-watering high levels of EV/EBITDA in the tech sector, but APX, at current prices, is not one of them.


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#Conference Call Reaction
Added 2 months ago

“The trick is not to learn to trust your gut feelings, but rather to discipline yourself to ignore them. Stand by your stocks as long as the fundamental story of the company hasn’t changed.”
– Peter Lynch


Appen: An Aussie Star on the World Stage

From the 5 golden Aussie technology stocks (the ‘WAAAX’), at current prices, we like the look of Appen most. Given our investing style and Appen’s recent fall from grace, the smallest member of the 5 WAAAX giants is looking particularly alluring right now. In this research note we will evaluate why, but first, let us lay out the context:

Appen collects and labels images, text, speech, audio, video, and other data used to build and continuously improve the world’s most innovative artificial intelligence systems.

Appen’s competitive moat includes having a global crowd of over 1 million skilled contractors who speak over 180 languages and dialects, in over 70,000 locations and 130 countries, and the industry’s most advanced AI-assisted data annotation platform.

It is this reliable and cost-effective training data that gives leaders in technology, automotive, financial services, retail, healthcare, and governments the confidence to deploy world-class AI products.

The companies utilising Appen to deploy AI products are the real deal. We are talking about the BIG end of town. Although Appen does not disclose their customer’s identity, they do reveal that they work with 8 of the 10 largest Western AI technology companies on Planet Earth.

We believe those customers to be Microsoft (Azure), Google (Google Cloud), Facebook, Twitter, Mozilla, IBM (Watson), VMware and American Express, in addition to smaller AI application developers. Not bad for a somewhat little Aussie company that was founded in 1996.

Working with the giants of the tech world has propelled Appen’s growth. Since 2015, the share price is up an astonishing 1368%. Indeed, Afterpay is the only member of the WAAAX that has outperformed Appen across the past half-decade.

The top line is up 546% across 2015-19, from $83M to $536M. Moreover, with the underlying EBITDA margin holding in a range between 16% and 20%, EBITDA is up 622% over the same 5-year period from $14M to $101M AUD. Over this 5-year period, the PE multiple has ranged from 44 to 114, reflecting its status as a high growth firm.


Appen’s sell-off: sizing the opportunity

On the 10th of December 2020, Appen downgraded its FY2020 earnings guidance on the back of its heavyweight US-technology customers confronting new lockdowns in California and shifting their resources to new projects away from data-intensive mature projects in the wake of COVID-19.

Appen is still projecting overall YoY growth in both revenue and earnings, but this growth is now signalled to be slower than was previously indicated – the company noted that it was not experiencing the usual ramp-up in sales that has been experienced historically at this time of year.

Consequently, the EBITDA range for FY20 was downgraded from $125M-$130M to $106-$109M AUD, which includes an FX adjustment (headwind) from US$0.70c to US$0.74c.

The key piece of information for investors to understand is that the earnings update relates to the re-allocation of work by Appen’s customers. Some of Appen’s US tech clients have temporarily shifted resources (engineers) away from major existing projects, which are data-intensive, to focus on new project opportunities (that enhance their long-term resilience and value), which are less data-intensive. The mature projects have not been abandoned completely.

The share price is down circa 43% from the all-time high of $43.50 to $24.66 at the time of writing, for a market capitalisation of circa $3 billion AUD. We have taken this opportunity to add Appen to the TEP Investments portfolio and it is now our largest holding.


“Whether we're talking about stocks or socks, I like buying quality merchandise when it is marked down.” – Warren Buffett


We take a long-term view on value creation, seeking companies that have a disciplined growth strategy, a laser-like focus on their core market and are the leader in their industry. This process gives one the opportunity to look past the short-term valuation metrics and short-term performance if we can have confidence a business has the platform and management team to create a more valuable business on a medium and long-term basis.

What we are looking to identify, is a business that might look expensive on short term valuation metrics (i.e., one year forward PE multiple) or look ‘down and out’ because of a temporary earnings downgrade but offer value in 3 to 5 years on the back of strong compound revenue and profit growth.


Will this earnings downgrade be short-lived or is it the beginning of a structural decline?

For earnings downgrades, if the information released to the market causing the downgrade does not impact your original investment thesis, then your margin of safety has improved, potentially dramatically. For any earnings downgrade with a high-quality company, we consider if the change is a result of cyclical or structural changes.

Our view is that this is not a structural (long term) change in demand for Appen’s products and services. The largest western technology firms who are Appen’s customers (e.g., Microsoft, Google, Amazon) continue to grow at pace. Moreover, Appen has an opportunity to secure blue-chip Asian technology clients in the future, such as Tencent or Alibaba, and we believe this opportunity is not priced into the share price. Appen also has an opportunity to expand into other verticals such as finance and healthcare.

On the Appen earnings update investor call, CEO Mark Brayan highlighted that the company believes this COVID-related development could be positive longer-term in terms of presenting new revenue avenues that could complement a return to growth on their historical programs of work. However, currently, Appen has a lack of visibility on this and their near-term work orders and this is something we are vigilant of as a risk. This is the first time we have seen evidence of Appen’s customers struggling to cope with multiple R&D programs of work. Our view is that ramp ups in engineering, product and software hiring at the US tech giants may indicate that this is a challenge that will be managed through over the next 12 months and beyond and is temporary.

The long-term trends for Appen remain exceptionally favourable. Spending on artificial intelligence is growing rapidly at 28% annually and AI adoption should accelerate in a post pandemic environment according to market observers such as the Boston Consulting Group (BCG). Further, online advertising, a major source of revenue for Appen’s key customers and a reasonable indicator of their spend, is forecast to rebound strongly in 2021 according to analyst forecasts. In the Q&A section of the trading update conference call, Mark Brayan declared that he expects Appen to resume a growth trajectory in 2021 in line with market growth. The structural tailwinds, as well as the strength of the existing pipeline for 2021, support a return to strong growth rates in 2021 in line with industry trends.

Our conclusion is that this is a short-term cyclical earnings impact not a structural headwinds earnings downgrade – AI is here to stay.


How much is Appen worth?

Valuing Appen is notoriously difficult.

The challenge of this task is evidenced by the fact that broker fair-value estimates for Appen i) swing wildly and ii) vary wildly among the sample set. When a single-year earnings downgrade of circa 15% shifts a broker estimate by more than 25% despite the value of the business being the present value of all future cashflows across the lifetime of the business – we have an overreaction.

It implies that buy-side research firms have no real indication as to the length, likelihood, and size of Appen’s future cashflows and are tinkering not just with short term earnings but modifying key long term inputs to their Appen valuation models. Changes to the long-term growth rate or the terminal value of Appen leads to enormous variation in the fair value of the business.

With pessimism and uncertainly clouding investors’ judgement right now, short term fluctuations appear to have crept into long term assumptions. This forms part of our investment thesis and is part of what we aim to take advantage of over the next 12-24 months with the Appen share price as long-term growth assumptions normalise again once Appen proves this current set back is temporary.

We have tested 3 scenarios across the TEP Investments APX discounted cash flow valuation model: i) the bear case, ii) the base case and iii) the bull case and determined a fair value target price using a blended valuation across the 3 scenarios.

Across all 3 scenarios, the following has been held constant:

  • A corporate tax rate of 30%

  • A weighted average cost of capital (WACC) of 9.9%.

    • This is based upon a cost of debt calculation that reflects i) the risk-free rate, ii) the country risk premium and iii) the sector’s (technology) specific cost of borrowing

    • Annual inflation rate of 2.40%

  • An EBITDA multiple method for calculating the terminal value

  • Assumed total shares on issue remains constant at 122.35M

  • Assumed the underlying EBITDA margin is 17% in 2020F and rises gradually (linearly) to 21% by 2030F (across 2015-2019, the EBITDA margin has ranged from 16% to 20%)

  • Assumed the EBIT margin is 11% in 2020F and rises gradually (linearly) to 16% by 2030F (across 2015-2019, the EBIT margin has ranged from 12% to 16%)


The Bear, The Bull & The Human

In the bear case, we assume that Appen is unable to meet its promise of returning to an industry standard growth rate (28% p.a.). We assume Appen’s top-line grows at 20% in 2021F and then gradually declines (linearly) to 12% growth YoY in 2030F. This is a low-growth scenario in which Appen would be underperforming the industry growth rate by a significant margin. We consider it a highly unlikely scenario but find it a useful exercise to determine a likely floor in the share price. In this scenario, we assume a terminal value multiple of 6x 2030F EBITDA to match the assumed low growth trajectory of the business. This scenario leads to a fair value share price estimate of $18.81 per share.

In the base case, we assume that Appen can meet its promise of returning to an industry standard growth rate (28% p.a.). We assume that Appen’s top line grows at 28% in 2021F and then gradually declines (linearly) to a growth rate of 20% YoY in 2030F. This is a moderate growth scenario that tapers off, such that Appen is likely to have underperformed the industry growth rate overall across the forecast period (2020-2030F). We consider this a viable scenario, but, there is a fair chance that the business outperforms this scenario if Appen can match and maintain the industry growth rate.  In this scenario, we assume a terminal value multiple of 7x 2030F EBITDA to match the moderate growth trajectory of the business. This scenario leads to a fair value share price estimate of $36.71 per share.

In the bull case, we assume that Appen beats the projected industry growth rate (28% p.a.). We assume Appen’s top line grows at 28% in 2021F and then rises to 36% YoY growth in 2022F buoyed by a bullish post-COVID environment and maturation of new customer projects and/or additional growth from one or more new blue-chip clients (tech giants – Alibaba, Tencent etc.) in China. We then assume that the growth rate gradually declines (linearly) back to a growth rate of 28% by 2030F. This is a high growth scenario that beats the projected industry growth rate and then tapers off in line with the industry growth rate. We consider this a possible scenario. In this scenario, we assume a terminal value multiple of 8x 2030F EBITDA to match the high growth trajectory of the business. This scenario leads to a fair value share price estimate of $66.98 per share.

Finally, reverse engineering the model to arrive at the current share price (circa $25 per share) reveals insights into what the investor community currently collectively believe the growth rate of Appen will be going forward.  Using the same margin, WACC, and terminal value assumptions as per the above scenarios, reverse engineering the model reveals that the investor community are collectively pricing in a revenue CAGR of 19% across 2020-2030F for a share price of $25 per share, well below the expected industry growth rate (28% p.a.). This contrasts with the Appen track record of high growth; APX achieved a 54% revenue CAGR across 1H FY2015 to 1H FY2020.

Ultimately, using a blended valuation approach and applying a likelihood of 15% to the base case, 50% to the base case and 35% to the bull case, we arrive at a TEP Investments target price for Appen of $44.62 per share.

The law of entropy & investor psychology

However, unless you have a crystal ball (we do not even get one here at Oxford University, unfortunately), projecting the future growth rate of this high-quality business is a little bit like throwing darts at a dartboard. We can refine our throw with practice, industry insights and objective research. Yet, the law of entropy states that all things in this universe trend towards disorder – there is no guarantee where our dart will land.

Moreover, left unchecked, disorder increases over time. Energy disperses, and systems dissolve into chaos. The more disordered something is, the more entropic we consider it. The Greek root of the word translates to “a turning towards transformation” — with that transformation being chaos.

Entropy is fundamentally a probabilistic idea: For every possible “usefully ordered” state of molecules, there are many, many more possible “disordered” states. Just as energy tends towards a less useful, more disordered state, so do businesses and organizations in general. Rearranging the molecules — or business systems and people — into an “ordered” state and maintaining it requires a continual injection of outside energy.

So, although we cannot hope to predict the world and future business outcomes with high levels of precision, can we still win on the roulette table of life that is the investing world?

I believe so.

There is something more predictable than the future ever could be and this is what the best investors manage to understand and take advantage of – human behaviour.  In short, we can predictably assume that human behaviour is unpredictable. Humans are not rational market participants. Humans are irrational market participants.

Humans emotions and investment markets will always continue to swing back and forth along the investment pendulum. Charlie Munger’s ‘Psychology of Human Misjudgment’ speech given at the Harvard Law School in the mid-1990s is in my eyes the finest investment speech ever given. The speech does not directly touch on investments but that tells you something – the most enduring advantages are psychological.

We do not need to predict the future of Appen with certainty. What we do need to know is that investors are currently viewing Appen with a bearish view of its future growth trajectory – this has been highlighted via the DCF analysis above. The pendulum of investing has swung out towards one of its two endpoints – it is much closer to fear than it is to greed. We also know that a pendulum rarely spends considerable amounts of time at either end of its arc and the further it swings out to an extreme the higher the likelihood that the pendulum will reverse towards the other direction.

With a more positive growth outlook from Appen at the February 2021 full year FY2020 update or with a more positive update at the H1FY2021 update in August 2021, analysts and investors will begin to normalise their view of long term Appen growth rates towards the base case and potentially to towards the bull case. Fair value of this company swings extraordinarily with relatively small shifts in the long-term growth rate.

With the earnings downgrade, the market pendulum has swung to the bears – but just like the inescapable tug of gravity, the reversal of the ‘sentiment pendulum’ is inevitable.

It is almost impossible to predict the future of Appen’s business performance flawlessly, but it is almost a certainty that investor sentiment will swing once more… and with it… the share price.



“We can all observe that stock prices, set in an auction market, are more volatile than business values. Several studies and casual observation reveal that individual prices oscillate widely around a central price year in year out, and for no apparent reason. Certainly, business values do not do this. Over time, this offers the prospect that any business, indeed all businesses, will be meaningfully mispriced.” – Nicholas Sleep

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Added 3 months ago

Re APX my read is that anyone who listened to the company's last call would not be too surprised at the downgrade. IMO the last call had quite a few caveats, MD was quite cautious, APX do not have significant visability on sales and although the US stock market is booming C19 is still impacting normal activity. i sold APX a little while ago with the strategy to see if we get a pre xmas downgrade then reass for potential re-entry. i think APX still has a growth pathway, a coupe of brokers still o/w, one upgdraed to o/w on this call. Likely Relevance will be irreleavnt (excuse the pun) one day, but not yet. my best guess at this stage is buy around $24-5. DYOR this is not advice.

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#Bull Case
Added 3 months ago

Buy the blood!, This company is not going anywhere and is part of a larger macro trend being machine learning/AI which will grow significantly long term time to scale in.

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#Conference Call Reaction
Last edited 3 months ago

Appen had a conference call regarding their latest update. They got really defensive on revenue growth etc... Especially when it came to how their top 5 customers (Comprising 88% of revenue) have reprioritised their data-intensive projects to other projects concerning vertical integration. They believe it is a "near-term" headwind and those customers will continue with previous projects after Covid. 

Their growth plans with the government took a massive hit (pandemic of course) and halted the sales growth there. They are very optimistic about autonomous driving technology and are labelling data on test cars across race tracks.     

The market belted the company on reducing the guidance estimates. However, the market is not looking at the longer-term picture with autonomous driving. Tesla will lead and vertically integrate but other car companies will use third party tech for their autonomous vehicle. Appen can be part of the third party tech. Comma Ai is used extensively across GM fleet, as well as Luminar for Volkswagen. Appen should sign up deals with companies like Comma Ai who have the data so that they can label the training data as Comma Ai does not have a large workforce. 

I do not know how far away they are with customers in the self-driving space and that was going to be my question on the conference call. The interpreter cut me out lol, most of the wall street guys talking about how it impacts EBITDA for 2HFY20 is not forward-looking. Plus, Appen puts it out there that it will decrease. 

What the crisis has told Appen is to diversify your customer base. Autonomous cars are the way, it will have to most data in the next 5 years. The miles driven by Tesla is just a barometer of how big the market can grow. Other car companies are not that sophisticated and do catalogue engineering.   


Just saw Dino's straw (WOW) Scale AI already in the space and doing data labelling for autonomous driving cars. Ok, I spoke too soon, competition is big and Scale has the lead. In saying that, more than 1 company could label the data. The datasets are massive.     


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#FY20 H1 Results
Added 6 months ago

27-Aug-2020:  FY20 Half Year Results   and   Investor Presentation   

plus  Appendix 4D & Interim Financial Report

Possibly another example of expectations getting ahead of reality.  Good result, but they've been sold down -10% anyway (so far).  I like APX, but I considered them expensive for what they are.  Still do.  They need to drop a lot further before I'd get seriously interested in buying some.

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